*guys

Hey Patch editors... recommend to the IT people that they put in an edit option!

you might want to read before posting on your fact that Al Maliki agreed thats incorrect because the iraqi parliment was debating it until then President elect Obama came up with a strategy that fit the Iraqis timeline for withdrawal

Not true, Novan. I was in Iraq at the time it was signed. If you remember, when it was signed between Bush and Maliki, someone threw a shoe at him.

What was being debated by the Iraqi parliament was an extension of US Forces in Iraq, which was in 2011.

Please read before posting and stop putting false accusations about our commander in chief your first and second posts contradict what you have stated read it

Novan, why the lies? It's right up there... here, I'll help you out by copy and pasting the relevant text.

"The SOFA calls for all U.S. forces to fall back out of Iraqi cities by June 2009 and to be out of Iraq by the end of 2011."... that was from the first article written in November 2008.

Here's a story on it's signed between the Iraqi and US governments on December 14th, 2008... http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2008/12/20081214-2.html

From my second citation above... "The United States and Iraq are negotiating the possibility of keeping some US forces in the country beyond a December 31 deadline for withdrawal, the US military's top officer said Thursday." the byline on that article is July 7th, 2011 (I was also deployed during that time as well).

Anything else?

Bryan don't confuse Novan with the facts ... you must be be telling us falsities because he says so. Here is another old NY Times article supporting your statements but I don't think you will be changing Novan's mind. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/17/world/middleeast/17iraq.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Thanks, In41time. I thought I was in the Twilight Zone or something for a moment.

Pres Bush signed off on the agreement theres a difference, but pres elect Obama implemented it so Obama will get the credit for that and ending both unpaid wars

Novan, he actually tried to redo the agreement so we could stay longer. That's what my second Reuters citation shows.

Obama didn't have any choice but to implement it because the agreement was already in place and ongoing when he came into office..

Naome, the article was about foreign policy with Reed claiming that it was Obama who "brought our troops home" from Iraq. It wasn't... as I showed, that agreement was in place before Obama was President and that he actually tried to extend our time there.

And what does your comment have to do with the article? Oh nothing, just more personal attacks...

your statement is false period

It's funny because Romney criticized the President tonight during the debate for pulling the troops out of Iraq. If Romney were President now we would still have troops in Iraq in violation of SOFA. So who doesn't understand foreign policy.

Yes, Romney stated that he wouldn't have failed where Obama did. Which is what you would expect from Obama... failure. Since his whole term has been riddled with it.

I should add that it's also expected that Liberals would just make things up. Sort of like you did by stating we'd have troops there in violation of the SOFA.

"...he article was about foreign policy with Reed claiming that it was Obama who "brought our troops home" from Iraq. (It wasn't.)

Neither Iraq, the rejected SOFA nor Al Maliki are mentioned in the OP.
I'll say it again, you're not from around here, and you're attempting to carpet-bag your way into local politics using an attack dog stance.

You're either reading your own text, or you're projecting a militarist stance.

That's not working for Sean Bielat in Massachusetts, and it won't work here.

Sen. Reed... "He took over a situation with two wars. We're out of Iraq, he insisted about that."

It's the video genius.... 00:13-00:18. I used the SOFA to demonstrate that Obama actually tried to keep us in Iraq longer, that Bush was the one who got and signed the agreement with us leaving Iraq in 2011.

Naome is your video component not working? I suspect it is working because you have posted videos to support your position. Please listen to what Jack Reed says in the video then you will understand the subsequent posts. Appreciate it. As regards to Bryan being "not from around here" I don't know how true or not that is but I don't really care if he is from "around here" as it doesn't change the facts or what Jack Reed said in the video. Bryan thanks for keeping the discussion above the personal attack fray and providing facts to back up your posts.

In41Time, I grew up in Bristol and I'm moving back to RI for good with this last transfer, and I'll be staying in RI when I retire.

Hi John:
As you see with my colleagues at Patch, all Editors have a "P" logo next to our names. Sandy rightly points out that my role includes moderating our comment boards to ensure that users don't violate our Terms of Use.
If you ever have a question to pose to me or another Patch Editor, simply click on our names and that will take you to our profile, which also includes our email address.
I invite you to weigh in on this topic as provided under our ToS.

That is so unintentionally funny - and telling.

This is one of the few well-moderated sites remaining in our area.
I've run afoul of the mods in the past, they're both consistent - and fair.

If a poster seeks a venue where a slanted stance can't be challenged -
try Craigslist Rants and Raves. Here, facts matter.

Lauren,
yessssss..."coffee..genius" ..lively, yet civil

That could certainly be possible, Rhodeworrier. Though if that it the case, why wait until 2008 to start working on a renewed SOFA?

The fact is, during my last deployment to Iraq (which was Nov 2008 - Oct 2009), there was zero enemy contact on my part or on anyone's part in my Division's Area of Responsibility. Our focus was the training of the Iraq forces, or on a personal level... the training of a Division level HQ for the Iraqi Border Police.

By then, Al Qaeda in Iraq was demolished (the Iraqi people turned against them) and the Mehdi Army was destroyed in an offensive in and around Basra.

So I, from my vantage point, see it as more of an inevitable policy shift based on the situation and our success in the country itself, which Bush recognized, and less on Congress.

*that is the case....

I need to proofread better, me thinks.

And FDR started the war with Japan. And your point is Ted? and BTW are your referring to President Bush?

Bryan..haven't been in theater since 05 and since retired. Was SOFA and ROE changed or modified before withdrawal to protect whatever CA assets or whatever advisers left behind?..a little off topic but foreign policy related all.

The part of the SOFA that changed was that in June 09 we had to have Iraqi Police/Army escort when passing through major population centers. The ROE was unchanged from when I was there previously.

Bush didnt stop it instead he left us w/$10TRILLION in debt

Actually it was $5 trillion (citation below), over 8 years and that was disgusting.... Obama has increased it over $6 trillion in little more than 3 years.

http://home.adelphi.edu/sbloch/deficits.html

Right - the winners tell the WHOLE story when recounting battles.

Chalmers Johnson warned of this region as a tinderbox in "BlowBack".
Intimating that the US had nothing to do with destabilizing local regimes, arming belligerents and profiting from active warfare is a jaundiced view.

As I've said before - commanding a desk inside the very apparatus that requires a fresh battleground to justify it's existence has lead us to search for trouble might not provide the widest view of the conflict.

If the only thing you've got is a hammer, all your problems come to look like nails.

I'm not so naive as to believe Nations and Tribes are ready to sing Kumbaya with us; I am suggesting that much of the conflict, such as with Iraq, we played a part.

Either as the match, or the strike plate - our DoD was complicit.

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/Jamie-Stiehm/2012/04/09/the-bush-family-an-american-tragedy

I would also suggest that as an attache to this, living on the base, you've been inculcated with the "Don't mess with Texas" ethos that lead us to jump ugly.

Anyone with a passing acquaintance with the history of Fascism can see parallels.

Naome, I understand the personal attacks are all that you have and using an OpEd as a citation is weak, but lets try to keep it clean and on subject please.

The last person who wants a war is a soldier. Personally, since 2001, I've been deployed 5 times, have gone away on training directly related to those deployments dozens of times for at least two weeks at a time... I don't like it, I don't like not seeing my children grow up... I don't like the fact that my oldest ended up going to three different High Schools (that's how often I've been moved around).

The fact that you can't recognize the above, and that you go right to Godwin's Law without any need to do so... amuses me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

"When a nation... tries to kill a President..." ???

If we had been serious about taking down the regime that bankrolled this, the bombs would have fallen on Riyadh. Iraq was a warning to their neighbors, and an opportunity to exploit taxpayer funds, for profit.

http://www.businesspundit.com/the-25-most-vicious-iraq-war-profiteers/

"That, in its essence, is fascism - ownership of government by an individual, by a group or by any other controlling private power."

FDR addressing Congress, 29APR1938

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
4. Supremacy of the Military
5. Rampant Sexism
6. Controlled Mass Media
7. Obsession with National Security
8. Religion and Government are Intertwined
9. Corporate Power is Protected
10. Labor Power is Suppressed
11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment
13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
14. Fraudulent Elections

Written by an author of fiction, but apt.

I never called anyone a Nazi, per Godwin's law. I do observe your willingness to
temporize events contrary to the facts that are coming to light about the colossal fraud that lead to Iraq.

http://www.theburningplatform.com/?p=32138

Naome, I said bankrolled terrorist groups not "bankrolled Al Qaeda".

They funded the Abu Nidal Group, Hamas, Hezbollah, Ansar Al-Sunna (now known as Ansar Al-Islam, he also let them have a base within Iraq), The Palestinian Liberation Front, and he also paid $25k to each family of someone who conducted a suicide bombing against Israel.

Also, that Citation you provided... you should find one for WW1, WW2, The Revolutionary War, the War of 1812, The war against Mexico, the War against Spain, the Civil War, the Crimean War, The Zulu War, the Peloponnesian War, because in each one there were people who made money.

That said, a lot of those companies provided services which a military organization is not equipped or manned to handle. For instance Haliburton ran a lot of dining facilities. Back in the 80s the military had enough cooks to feed the whole military. In the 90s, a certain Mr. Clinton cut the military down to bear bones and we started using contractors... not only overseas but even in the dining facilities in the states. I also worked with L3, they managed our interpreters. I also worked with Aegis who provided a skill set that we didn't have in areas I can't really talk about on here.

You can ignore the 14 points for going to war with Iraq all you want. You can ignore them shooting at us, trying to kill a President, ect, I can't make you look at facts, so enjoy your conspiracy theories.

I haven't watched the video yet, but based on your statement, I agree with you. That's why when Romney spoke about Pakistan on a question about Afghanistan that he really scored some points with me. When we pull out, the Afghans are only going to be successful if Pakistan is able to gain control of its border.

on me..regular?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNC0kIzM1Fo

"...so the uninformed can still make uninformed comments. To those who just like to spout off without knowing what you are talking about, please be informed before you speak. That also means read from several sources, not just mediamatters or the daily cos."

You're suggesting that those reading MediaMatters or The Daily Kos are uninformed? Compared to whom?

Do you mean CNN as the middleground, or something else?
You're not suggesting that Fox is a news outlet, are you?

Naome, If Vinne won't say it I wil, I am saying that Fox is every bit as much of a news outlet as CNN, MSNBC and Mediamatters. Sure they, The Daily Kos etc, are very informed by the Dems talking points, do you disgree? If so, why do they all come up with the same story line all at the same time, Dem talking points?

Here is the authority to use force passed by Congress. http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/bliraqreshouse.htm

As you can see, 3 of the 14 reasons have to do with WMDs... and one of those instances are just about the Weapon's Inspectors.

Let me ask, which of these acts should be considered an Act of War to you.

Shooting at our aircraft?
Bankrolling organizations that attack American citizens?
Harboring two terrorist organizations that attack American citizens?
Attempts to assassinate a US President?

My question is, if Hussien had let the Weapon's Inspectors do their job, if they never shot at our planes, supported terrorist groups or tried to assassinate a President, do you think we would have gone to war with Iraq anyway?

Please explain exactly how I've become a "problem poster"? I still use citations, and I never call anyone a name. Because I'm in the middle of a move, I don't have the time to write full blogs anymore. Once I'm settled, I'll start again.

Brian, you are a problem poster because you represent a different point of view. What ever you do, don't tell them about Santa. You'll just make people upset.

LeaveRI,
You do know about Jack Reed's military career right?

@ J Lane..ok I normally don't do others homework..look at these and show me the battle experience years or positions..none, zilch, zero...would you let a physician who just because they went to medical school 30 years ago and has no experience with a patient, work on you or your kids etc..correct..they have no business in the business.
http://www.biography.com/people/jack-reed-354526
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Reed_(politician)

West Point Grad, Retired as Major, Army Ranger, 82 Airborne...but it is true he was never deployed in a combat zone. Not taking away anything from his service which is quite commendable. I'm not a big Senator Reed supporter but he didn't take the easy road in regards to his military service career.

IN41..exactly..my point was the expeience in his MDMP under other than peace time circumstances..he did have the good schools and badges/tabs though..correct in assuming he didn't just ride the piney desk to the end.

?????????????????